{"id":1584,"date":"2012-11-11T00:27:09","date_gmt":"2012-11-11T08:27:09","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/?p=1584"},"modified":"2012-11-11T00:27:09","modified_gmt":"2012-11-11T08:27:09","slug":"interesting-dimensions","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/?p=1584","title":{"rendered":"Interesting dimensions"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>As the car gets further\u00a0developed some of the interesting questions from early on are finding answers.<\/p>\n<p>One of those had to do with the car&#8217;s width.\u00a0 It is spec&#8217;d at 72.3&#8243;, which is quite a bit wider than the competition:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>E36 BMW: 66.9&#8243;<\/li>\n<li>WRX: 66.7&#8243;<\/li>\n<li>RX8: 69.7&#8243;<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>Over 2.5&#8243; wider than the closest car, a significant difference.\u00a0 The general pages on this site around <a title=\"Comparative Vehicle Dynamics - Transitions\" href=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/?page_id=939\" target=\"_blank\">Transition<\/a>\u00a0and <a title=\"Comparative Vehicle Dynamics - Skidpad\" href=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/?page_id=764\" target=\"_blank\">Skidpad<\/a> performance go into detail on the pros and cons of width.\u00a0 Unfortunately in autocross, width is mostly a con.\u00a0 However, the measurement of width is not an exact science &#8211; where do you measure?\u00a0 Do you include things like door mirrors &#8211; which are high enough to miss cones and therefore not matter for autocross?\u00a0 Were all those cars measured in the same way?<\/p>\n<p>A commonly used measurement is the distance, on the ground, between the outermost edges of the rear tires.\u00a0 That number best represents how wide your car&#8217;s ass is, and\u00a0how careful you&#8217;ll have to be in getting it through the course without knocking things over.<\/p>\n<p>Super Stock C5 Z06 Corvettes are usually around 72-73&#8243; in this measurement.\u00a0 The C6 Z06 is a bit wider, in the 77-78&#8243; range.\u00a0 The Viper is also about 77.5&#8243;.\u00a0 I also remember performing this measurement on James Gunn-Wilkinson&#8217;s 996 GT2 the year it won ASP nationally &#8211; it was only about 69.5&#8243; wide, even with 335 tires on wide wheels.\u00a0 That was a real advantage over the ASP C5 Z06s, which had swelled into the 77&#8243;+ range to fit their big SP tires.\u00a0 Some CP cars have been measured over 80&#8243; wide!\u00a0 Perhaps that&#8217;s why sometimes their driving efforts look like Kim Kardashian trying to make it through the turnstyle on the Paris Metro without touching the sides&#8230;<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/rear_wheel.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" class=\"alignnone size-medium wp-image-1587\" title=\"rear_wheel\" src=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/rear_wheel-300x225.jpg\" alt=\"Rear Jongbloed wheel on Jason Rhoades 1967 STX Camaro with Yokohama Advan Neova AD08 tire 265\/40-18\" width=\"300\" height=\"225\" srcset=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/rear_wheel-300x225.jpg 300w, http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/rear_wheel-1024x768.jpg 1024w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 300px) 100vw, 300px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>Given the specified width for the Camaro, was expecting a number for the rear in the 71-73&#8243; range.\u00a0 Delighted to find, the value was only 69.25&#8243;.\u00a0\u00a0I estimate between 1\/8&#8243; and 3\/8&#8243; per side the wheels could be spaced outward, if needed.\u00a0 That&#8217;d get the rear width measurement up close to 70&#8243;, but still, that&#8217;s really not that bad.\u00a0 Besides the width penalty in transitions, an additional downside of adding rear track, is it increases the wheel speed differential between the inside and outside rear tires in a corner, which can be troublesome to certain types of limited slip differential.\u00a0 Narrowing rear track is a common trick in trying to mitigate diff problems.\u00a0 On the plus side, additional rear track reduces total rear weight transfer at a given lateral acceleration, leaving a little more weight on the inside rear tire for acceleration.<\/p>\n<p>Since the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/?p=1514\" target=\"_blank\">Sunken Battleship<\/a>\u00a0post from a couple weeks ago,\u00a0have since procured various spacers for the front end.\u00a0 Good news, looks like a full 1&#8243; of spacer in front passes.\u00a0 Can even turn to full lock at ride height!<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/1inch_spacers.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" class=\"alignnone size-medium wp-image-1586\" title=\"1inch_spacers\" src=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/1inch_spacers-225x300.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"225\" height=\"300\" srcset=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/1inch_spacers-225x300.jpg 225w, http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/1inch_spacers-768x1024.jpg 768w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 225px) 100vw, 225px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>This is a much better situation &#8211; both for appearance and for performance.\u00a0 \u00a0It&#8217;s only a ~3% increase in front track, but that means 3% less weight moved across the axle, which could mean as much as 1-2% more potential front grip.\u00a0 Next set of STX wheels will probably be built with a lot less backspace.\u00a0 Advantage of these, is the tires could be stood straight up (zero camber) and still fit ok with the spacers removed.\u00a0 18&#215;9&#8217;s with only 4.5&#8243; backspace (which these effectively have now) will only fit right with a ton of negative camber on front.<\/p>\n<p>Raised the front a little bit too from last\u00a0time.\u00a0 It looks a lot less tucked, but a big part of that is this tire is about 1.5&#8243; shorter than the vintage-style Avon.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/front_wheel.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" class=\"alignnone size-medium wp-image-1588\" title=\"front_wheel\" src=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/front_wheel-300x225.jpg\" alt=\"Jongbloed front wheel on Jason Rhoades 1967 STX Camaro with 265\/35-18 Yokohama Advan Neova AD08 tire\" width=\"300\" height=\"225\" srcset=\"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/front_wheel-300x225.jpg 300w, http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/front_wheel-1024x768.jpg 1024w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 300px) 100vw, 300px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>With the spacers, the equivalent measurement to the one quoted above for the rear &#8211; 71&#8243;.\u00a0 Very pleased by that &#8211; a front track wider than rear should really help the chronic understeer these chassis seem plagued with.\u00a0 Front width is more manageable too when driving, largely because it&#8217;s part of what you can see!<\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>As the car gets further\u00a0developed some of the interesting questions from early on are finding answers. One of those had to do with the car&#8217;s width.\u00a0 It is spec&#8217;d at 72.3&#8243;, which is quite a bit wider than the competition: E36 BMW: 66.9&#8243; WRX: 66.7&#8243; RX8: 69.7&#8243; Over 2.5&#8243; wider than the closest car, a [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":[],"categories":[11],"tags":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1584"}],"collection":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=1584"}],"version-history":[{"count":7,"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1584\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":1595,"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1584\/revisions\/1595"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=1584"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=1584"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.rhoadescamaro.com\/build\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=1584"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}